Empath/saved posts - Revision history

SLIMY: /* Empathic Linking */ link to new main article in the title

2025-03-30T21:09:17Z

Empathic Linking: link to new main article in the title

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:09, 30 March 2025
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	GameMaster Oscuro		GameMaster Oscuro

	==Empathic Linking==		==[[Empathic Linking]]==
	{{saved-post		{{saved-post
	\| category = Empaths		\| category = Empaths

VANKRASN39: /* 2010 */ insert Empathic Linking posts

2017-03-29T15:34:22Z

2010: insert Empathic Linking posts

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 GameMaster Estild
-==2010==
+===2010===
 {{saved-post
  | category = Empaths
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 GameMaster Oscuro
 [[Category:Empath]]

VANKRASN39: /* 2008 */

2017-03-29T15:33:41Z

2008

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:33, 29 March 2017
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	Warden		Warden

	==2008==		===2008===
	{{saved-post		{{saved-post
	\| category = Empaths		\| category = Empaths

VANKRASN39: /* 2007 */

2017-03-29T15:33:24Z

2007

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:33, 29 March 2017
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	__TOC__		__TOC__
			==Empath Design Direction==
	==2007==		===2007===
	{{saved-post		{{saved-post
	\| category = Empaths		\| category = Empaths

VANKRASN39: VANKRASN39 moved page Empath design direction (saved post) to Empath/saved posts: saved post reorg

2017-03-29T15:29:41Z

VANKRASN39 moved page Empath design direction (saved post) to Empath/saved posts: saved post reorg

← Older revision	Revision as of 10:29, 29 March 2017
(No difference)

VANKRASN39: formatting

2016-02-26T22:16:07Z

formatting

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:16, 26 February 2016
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			__TOC__
		⚫	==2007==
	{{saved-post		{{saved-post
	\| category = Empaths		\| category = Empaths
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	\| date = 11/14/2007 8:29:17 PM		\| date = 11/14/2007 8:29:17 PM
	\| subject = Empath Design Direction		\| subject = Empath Design Direction
		⚫	}}At the start of GS4, we announced that [[Empath]]s, as Mental-Spirit hybrids, would eventually be losing access to the [[Major Spiritual\|Major Spirit]] list and gaining access to the [[Minor Mental]] list. At the time, Empaths were a strong service class with weak combat abilities, and our intention was that access to the Minor Mental list would help not only by emphasizing their hybrid Mental nature, but also by providing additional combat options to the class.
	}}
⚫	At the start of GS4, we announced that [[Empath]]s, as Mental-Spirit hybrids, would eventually be losing access to the [[Major Spiritual\|Major Spirit]] list and gaining access to the [[Minor Mental]] list. At the time, Empaths were a strong service class with weak combat abilities, and our intention was that access to the Minor Mental list would help not only by emphasizing their hybrid Mental nature, but also by providing additional combat options to the class.

	As part of our continued development of Empaths and looking forward to the Minor Mental list, we have re-evaluated the design direction and have decided to no longer pursue converting Empaths from Major Spirit to Minor Mental. This decision was not made lightly; it is based on a review of the current state of Empaths and the ramifications of the change in lists.		As part of our continued development of Empaths and looking forward to the Minor Mental list, we have re-evaluated the design direction and have decided to no longer pursue converting Empaths from Major Spirit to Minor Mental. This decision was not made lightly; it is based on a review of the current state of Empaths and the ramifications of the change in lists.
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	Warden		Warden

			==2008==
	----
	=2=
	{{saved-post		{{saved-post
	\| category = Empaths		\| category = Empaths
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	\| date = 8/4/2008 1:48:14 AM		\| date = 8/4/2008 1:48:14 AM
	\| subject = Re: Proposal: 1140 - Molecular Morph		\| subject = Re: Proposal: 1140 - Molecular Morph
		⚫	}}''I'm still in the 30 day period but not for much longer, and when I see [[GameMaster\|GM]] posts that I should train in this or that, I do take it seriously. I just need to know what to give up.''
	}}
	<i>
⚫	I'm still in the 30 day period but not for much longer, and when I see [[GameMaster\|GM]] posts that I should train in this or that, I do take it seriously. I just need to know what to give up.~~</i>~~

	We (staff) can't really tell you what to train in. One of the great things about role-playing games is that you get to make choices for your character's design. It's up to you to weigh the advantages and disadvantages for each skill.		We (staff) can't really tell you what to train in. One of the great things about role-playing games is that you get to make choices for your character's design. It's up to you to weigh the advantages and disadvantages for each skill.
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	GameMaster Estild		GameMaster Estild

			==2010==
	Cleric/Empath Team

	"I prefer the company of peasants because they have not been educated sufficiently to reason incorrectly." - Michel de Montaigne

⚫	==3==
	{{saved-post		{{saved-post
	\| category = Empaths		\| category = Empaths
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	\| date = 9/11/2010 9:39:52 AM		\| date = 9/11/2010 9:39:52 AM
	\| subject = Re: Empath Inequity		\| subject = Re: Empath Inequity
		⚫	}}Class-based advantages are a natural part of a class-based system. The fact that empaths excel as the heartiest of the pures (with their [[Physical Fitness]] access) is an intentional design aspect. This is an important facet of the healing portion of the class. They need quick access to a high amount of [[hitpoint\|HPs]] and need a high natural HP recovery rate. Perhaps later, they may also need the [[stamina]] associated with additional PF training.
	}}
⚫	Class-based advantages are a natural part of a class-based system. The fact that ~~Empaths~~ excel as the heartiest of the pures (with their [[Physical Fitness~~\|physical fitness~~]] access) is an intentional design aspect. This is an important facet of the healing portion of the class. They need quick access to a high amount of [[hitpoint\|HPs]] and need a high natural HP recovery rate. Perhaps later, they may also need the [[stamina]] associated with additional PF training.

	Empaths casting through their primary circle through wounds again is an intentional benefit of the class, just as [[~~Bard~~]]s not losing [[mana]] when [[Spell hindrance\|armor hindrance]] affects their [[Bard Base\|primary circle]]. Class-based systems yield class-based benefits.		Empaths casting through their primary circle through wounds again is an intentional benefit of the class, just as [[bard]]s not losing [[mana]] when [[Spell hindrance\|armor hindrance]] affects their [[Bard Base\|primary circle]]. Class-based systems yield class-based benefits.

	Empaths can pull off chain class armors, but it comes at a significant TP investment (their armor training cost is even higher than [[~~Wizard~~]]s'). [[Cleric]]s do this much better, and again, it is an aspect of spiritual magic. Notice that the Empath circle hindrances are actually higher in the heavier armors than the spiritual circles, though. It does not reach the level of difficulty that Wizards and [[Sorcerer]]s have, but it is still out-paced by Clerics. These are intentional design aspects - Empaths are meant to be hearty and well-defended.		Empaths can pull off chain class armors, but it comes at a significant TP investment (their armor training cost is even higher than [[wizard]]s'). [[Cleric]]s do this much better, and again, it is an aspect of spiritual magic. Notice that the Empath circle hindrances are actually higher in the heavier armors than the spiritual circles, though. It does not reach the level of difficulty that Wizards and [[Sorcerer]]s have, but it is still out-paced by Clerics. These are intentional design aspects - Empaths are meant to be hearty and well-defended.

	However, that heartiness is meant to come at a cost - their attack prowess. Empaths have a far smaller list of options of attack and disabling spells than the other pures classes, by a significant margin from the Wizard/Sorcerer side and slightly on the Cleric side (though I'd like to see more Cleric attacks). I agree that Empaths have an unfair advantage when it comes to physical attack strength. They do outpace some semis (albeit by a very small margin). The fact that [[1109]] only increases melee [[Attack Strength\|AS]] and not affecting [[bolt]] AS for a pure class is odd design, in my opinion, and is an obvious left over from the GS3 days when Empaths had no offensive spells to pull them through combat. Though I'm of the mindset that Clerics and Sorcerers could use some help in the bolt AS area, it doesn't mean that Empath bolt AS is too high. Wizards are their superior by a large enough margin.		However, that heartiness is meant to come at a cost - their attack prowess. Empaths have a far smaller list of options of attack and disabling spells than the other pures classes, by a significant margin from the Wizard/Sorcerer side and slightly on the Cleric side (though I'd like to see more Cleric attacks). I agree that Empaths have an unfair advantage when it comes to physical attack strength. They do outpace some semis (albeit by a very small margin). The fact that [[1109]] only increases melee [[Attack Strength\|AS]] and not affecting [[bolt]] AS for a pure class is odd design, in my opinion, and is an obvious left over from the GS3 days when Empaths had no offensive spells to pull them through combat. Though I'm of the mindset that Clerics and Sorcerers could use some help in the bolt AS area, it doesn't mean that Empath bolt AS is too high. Wizards are their superior by a large enough margin.
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	GameMaster Oscuro		GameMaster Oscuro

	[[Rogue]] Team<br>
	Cleric/Empath Team

	[[Category:Empath]]		[[Category:Empath]]

SPYRIDONM1: /* 3 */ fixed link (disambiguation)

2015-03-03T20:16:00Z

3: fixed link (disambiguation)

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:16, 3 March 2015
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	Additionally, the other substantive alt. exp. gain form, lockpicking, requires TP investments. We'd like there to be a clearer TP investment that goes along with healing. The skills that are obvious for that are Physical Fitness, [[First Aid]] and [[Mental Lore, Transformation\|Mental Lore - Transformation]] and, to a lesser degree, [[Spiritual Lore, Blessings\|Spiritual Lore - Blessings]]. We already have begun adding in these aspects, but we think we can do more in this regard.		Additionally, the other substantive alt. exp. gain form, lockpicking, requires TP investments. We'd like there to be a clearer TP investment that goes along with healing. The skills that are obvious for that are Physical Fitness, [[First Aid]] and [[Mental Lore, Transformation\|Mental Lore - Transformation]] and, to a lesser degree, [[Spiritual Lore, Blessings\|Spiritual Lore - Blessings]]. We already have begun adding in these aspects, but we think we can do more in this regard.

	One final "inequity" that I'm aware of but wasn't on the list is the idea of hybrid [[CS]]/[[TD]] calculations. As it stands, the Empath spell circle is considered a fully spiritual circle with respect to CS and TD calculations. With the release of the [[Minor Mental\|MnM]] list, we will update Empath TD spells to provide [[hybrid]] Spiritual-Mental TD and the Empath circle will be considered a hybrid Spiritual-Mental CS circle, thus receiving fractional benefits from either Spiritual or Mental CS boosters. This is a minor adjustment in the end, but it's something that needs to be resolved.		One final "inequity" that I'm aware of but wasn't on the list is the idea of hybrid [[CS]]/[[TD]] calculations. As it stands, the Empath spell circle is considered a fully spiritual circle with respect to CS and TD calculations. With the release of the [[Minor Mental\|MnM]] list, we will update Empath TD spells to provide [[Hybrid profession\|hybrid]] Spiritual-Mental TD and the Empath circle will be considered a hybrid Spiritual-Mental CS circle, thus receiving fractional benefits from either Spiritual or Mental CS boosters. This is a minor adjustment in the end, but it's something that needs to be resolved.

	I think I addressed all the concerns. In summary, I do agree that Empaths have a couple areas that need work and we would like to address these eventually, but they are not on our short list at the moment. (As for Estild and I, that short list right now is comprised of unarmed combat, [[340]], the Monk CML and the [[FWI]] hunting.)		I think I addressed all the concerns. In summary, I do agree that Empaths have a couple areas that need work and we would like to address these eventually, but they are not on our short list at the moment. (As for Estild and I, that short list right now is comprised of unarmed combat, [[340]], the Monk CML and the [[FWI]] hunting.)

GS4-KEIOS: 3 revisions: Krakiipedia Import

2014-12-31T17:39:53Z

3 revisions: Krakiipedia Import

← Older revision	Revision as of 12:39, 31 December 2014
(No difference)

MILQUETOAST: /* 2 */

2010-09-11T14:51:46Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:51, 11 September 2010
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	"I prefer the company of peasants because they have not been educated sufficiently to reason incorrectly." - Michel de Montaigne		"I prefer the company of peasants because they have not been educated sufficiently to reason incorrectly." - Michel de Montaigne

			==3==
			{{saved-post
			\| category = Empaths
			\| topic = Developer's Corner - Empaths
			\| messagenum = 3489
			\| author = GS4-OSCURO
			\| date = 9/11/2010 9:39:52 AM
			\| subject = Re: Empath Inequity
			}}
			Class-based advantages are a natural part of a class-based system. The fact that Empaths excel as the heartiest of the pures (with their [[Physical Fitness\|physical fitness]] access) is an intentional design aspect. This is an important facet of the healing portion of the class. They need quick access to a high amount of [[hitpoint\|HPs]] and need a high natural HP recovery rate. Perhaps later, they may also need the [[stamina]] associated with additional PF training.

			Empaths casting through their primary circle through wounds again is an intentional benefit of the class, just as [[Bard]]s not losing [[mana]] when [[Spell hindrance\|armor hindrance]] affects their [[Bard Base\|primary circle]]. Class-based systems yield class-based benefits.

			Empaths can pull off chain class armors, but it comes at a significant TP investment (their armor training cost is even higher than [[Wizard]]s'). [[Cleric]]s do this much better, and again, it is an aspect of spiritual magic. Notice that the Empath circle hindrances are actually higher in the heavier armors than the spiritual circles, though. It does not reach the level of difficulty that Wizards and [[Sorcerer]]s have, but it is still out-paced by Clerics. These are intentional design aspects - Empaths are meant to be hearty and well-defended.

			However, that heartiness is meant to come at a cost - their attack prowess. Empaths have a far smaller list of options of attack and disabling spells than the other pures classes, by a significant margin from the Wizard/Sorcerer side and slightly on the Cleric side (though I'd like to see more Cleric attacks). I agree that Empaths have an unfair advantage when it comes to physical attack strength. They do outpace some semis (albeit by a very small margin). The fact that [[1109]] only increases melee [[Attack Strength\|AS]] and not affecting [[bolt]] AS for a pure class is odd design, in my opinion, and is an obvious left over from the GS3 days when Empaths had no offensive spells to pull them through combat. Though I'm of the mindset that Clerics and Sorcerers could use some help in the bolt AS area, it doesn't mean that Empath bolt AS is too high. Wizards are their superior by a large enough margin.

			The [[Sigil of Power]] discussion has been beaten to death and while I agree that an Empath is the pure class that easily can take the most advantage of it, it requires a significant TP investment to even come close to the efficacy of [[Sign of Wracking]]. It's not an issue, at least at this time.

			I don't know what the issue with Empath TP costs is. I think they're absolutely in line with where they need to be. What is the concern there exactly?

			Healing [[experience]] has also been discussed to death, and the final verdict is that it comes so infrequently that it is not of balance concern in the regard that they have it available. What is concerning is that there is virtually no risk involved in healing yet the amount of experience is relatively significant. With hunting there is obvious risk, with [[lockpicking]] there are deadly [[trap]]s. Healing carries only the risk of bleeding out or over healing blood, both of which only occur when one is new at the practice or completely not paying attention. We'd like to incorporate more risk for the reward.

			Additionally, the other substantive alt. exp. gain form, lockpicking, requires TP investments. We'd like there to be a clearer TP investment that goes along with healing. The skills that are obvious for that are Physical Fitness, [[First Aid]] and [[Mental Lore, Transformation\|Mental Lore - Transformation]] and, to a lesser degree, [[Spiritual Lore, Blessings\|Spiritual Lore - Blessings]]. We already have begun adding in these aspects, but we think we can do more in this regard.

			One final "inequity" that I'm aware of but wasn't on the list is the idea of hybrid [[CS]]/[[TD]] calculations. As it stands, the Empath spell circle is considered a fully spiritual circle with respect to CS and TD calculations. With the release of the [[Minor Mental\|MnM]] list, we will update Empath TD spells to provide [[hybrid]] Spiritual-Mental TD and the Empath circle will be considered a hybrid Spiritual-Mental CS circle, thus receiving fractional benefits from either Spiritual or Mental CS boosters. This is a minor adjustment in the end, but it's something that needs to be resolved.

			I think I addressed all the concerns. In summary, I do agree that Empaths have a couple areas that need work and we would like to address these eventually, but they are not on our short list at the moment. (As for Estild and I, that short list right now is comprised of unarmed combat, [[340]], the Monk CML and the [[FWI]] hunting.)

			GameMaster Oscuro

			[[Rogue]] Team<br>
			Cleric/Empath Team

	[[Category:Empath]]		[[Category:Empath]]

MILQUETOAST: /* 2 */

2008-08-04T13:35:46Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:35, 4 August 2008
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	}}		}}
	<i>		<i>
	I'm still in the 30 day period but not for much longer, and when I see [[~~Gamemaster~~\|GM]] posts that I should train in this or that, I do take it seriously. I just need to know what to give up.</i>		I'm still in the 30 day period but not for much longer, and when I see [[GameMaster\|GM]] posts that I should train in this or that, I do take it seriously. I just need to know what to give up.</i>

	We (staff) can't really tell you what to train in. One of the great things about role-playing games is that you get to make choices for your character's design. It's up to you to weigh the advantages and disadvantages for each skill.		We (staff) can't really tell you what to train in. One of the great things about role-playing games is that you get to make choices for your character's design. It's up to you to weigh the advantages and disadvantages for each skill.