Research:Open ambushing - Revision history

PRICKLIES at 18:51, 27 April 2021

2021-04-27T18:51:33Z

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			==Official Statement==

			As per GM Naijin (27 Apr 2021, Discord #mechanics), open aimed melee considers CM and Ambush equally, using bonus (not rank).

			Earlier player speculation follows below.

	==Open Ambushing (ambushing without hiding)==		==Open Ambushing (ambushing without hiding)==

VANKRASN39: /* Resources */ sort

2017-08-07T19:20:29Z

Resources: sort

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	* Also Aequis/Nylis 2015 confirmatory testing		* Also Aequis/Nylis 2015 confirmatory testing

	[[Category:Player Research]]		[[Category:Player Research\|O]]

VANKRASN39: change category

2017-08-07T19:04:56Z

change category

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	* Also Aequis/Nylis 2015 confirmatory testing		* Also Aequis/Nylis 2015 confirmatory testing

			[[Category:Player Research]]
	[[category:Guides]]

VANKRASN39: VANKRASN39 moved page Open ambushing guide to Research:Open ambushing: new research prefix

2017-08-07T18:58:57Z

VANKRASN39 moved page Open ambushing guide to Research:Open ambushing: new research prefix

← Older revision	Revision as of 13:58, 7 August 2017
(No difference)

VANKRASN39: VANKRASN39 moved page Open ambushing to Open ambushing guide: specify it is a guide

2017-03-16T22:07:21Z

VANKRASN39 moved page Open ambushing to Open ambushing guide: specify it is a guide

← Older revision	Revision as of 17:07, 16 March 2017
(No difference)

MICHN18 at 16:08, 4 September 2015

2015-09-04T16:08:31Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:08, 4 September 2015
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	The second and third tests show the extent of the diminishing returns. In the second test my 54 additional ranks of CM provided a 2% increase in accuracy over Madmountain. In the third tests we both received comparatively small increases in accuracy for additional ranks in Ambush beyond 30. The extreme nature of the diminishing returns suggest logarithmic function comparable to Redux.		The second and third tests show the extent of the diminishing returns. In the second test my 54 additional ranks of CM provided a 2% increase in accuracy over Madmountain. In the third tests we both received comparatively small increases in accuracy for additional ranks in Ambush beyond 30. The extreme nature of the diminishing returns suggest logarithmic function comparable to Redux.


	==Additional Research==		==Additional Research==
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	Based on today's test I feel extremely confident that 24 ranks of Ambush is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from Ambush training. In my opinion, this finding also strongly suggests that 24 ranks of CM is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from CM training. I stand by my position that aiming accuracy is the sum of two separate equations, one for each skill where each skill has its own independent soft cap.		Based on today's test I feel extremely confident that 24 ranks of Ambush is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from Ambush training. In my opinion, this finding also strongly suggests that 24 ranks of CM is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from CM training. I stand by my position that aiming accuracy is the sum of two separate equations, one for each skill where each skill has its own independent soft cap.


	==Resources==		==Resources==

MICHN18 at 16:08, 4 September 2015

2015-09-04T16:08:04Z

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	Based on today's test I feel extremely confident that 24 ranks of Ambush is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from Ambush training. In my opinion, this finding also strongly suggests that 24 ranks of CM is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from CM training. I stand by my position that aiming accuracy is the sum of two separate equations, one for each skill where each skill has its own independent soft cap.		Based on today's test I feel extremely confident that 24 ranks of Ambush is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from Ambush training. In my opinion, this finding also strongly suggests that 24 ranks of CM is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from CM training. I stand by my position that aiming accuracy is the sum of two separate equations, one for each skill where each skill has its own independent soft cap.


	==This Space Reserved for Stabbing Things in the Eye==

	Going to need a new script for this and I'll need to run enough tests to see what body location an aimed shot at a missing eye defaults to. But I'm keen to stab things in the eye with my lance, so maybe this weekend.

	==Resources==		==Resources==

MICHN18 at 13:16, 4 September 2015

2015-09-04T13:16:09Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:16, 4 September 2015
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	The second and third tests show the extent of the diminishing returns. In the second test my 54 additional ranks of CM provided a 2% increase in accuracy over Madmountain. In the third tests we both received comparatively small increases in accuracy for additional ranks in Ambush beyond 30. The extreme nature of the diminishing returns suggest logarithmic function comparable to Redux.		The second and third tests show the extent of the diminishing returns. In the second test my 54 additional ranks of CM provided a 2% increase in accuracy over Madmountain. In the third tests we both received comparatively small increases in accuracy for additional ranks in Ambush beyond 30. The extreme nature of the diminishing returns suggest logarithmic function comparable to Redux.

⚫	==~~Speculation and~~ Additional Research==

		⚫	==Additional Research==
	Based on the above, it is certain that accuracy from Ambush training reaches a point of extreme diminishing returns between 15 and 30 ranks. I strongly suspect that point to be at or very close to 30 ranks, but the data is not conclusive on that point.

			There was some discussion on the PC that 24 ranks of Ambush might be the magic number. This morning I decided to try it out. While my test was cut short by a grizzled sorcerer, I still got a statistically significant number of attacks in.
	We can infer that there is a comparable point for CM training. If the number of ranks of Ambush involved is any guide, the point for CM could be extremely low. Perhaps also in the neighborhood of 30. This is largely irrelevant, however, as those characters who open ambush with melee weapons commonly train CM every level.

			There are some slight modifications to my skills and methodology since my last tests that bear mentioning. For this test I had an enhanced 214 CM ranks (two less than my previous tests) and 24 Ambush ranks. Once again I was aiming at the heads of Grimswarm orcs with my lance.
	As far as additional research goes, there is one factor that has not been explored which I feel could logically be related to accuracy. That is, action penalty from armor. Madmountain made no mention of his armor or Armor Use training, but I'd be willing to bet that he was wearing full plate without sufficient overtraining in Armor Use to reduce the action penalty. During my tests I was wearing full plate with 150 ranks in Armor Use, which is not enough to reduce the action penalty.

			I also took into consideration the widely held belief that aiming at the head when the head already has a rank three wound causes a successful attack to default to the chest. In this situation there is no way to distinguish between a successful aimed attack defaulting to the chest and a miss that happens to hit the chest. To avoid this problem I discounted all subsequent hits on a foe that already had a rank three head wound.
	Maybe if I'm feeling saucy I'll throw on some hauberk and head back out.

			Before getting imploded I scored 210 hits (see above for definition of 'hit' in this context). Out of those hits, 159 struck the head and 51 struck some other location. None of my swings failed to find an opening for a strike. This yields 75.7% accuracy. I attribute the slight increase in accuracy to the more careful treatment of default targeting in the case of existing rank three wounds. I estimate that a repeat of my original test with 216 CM ranks and 30 Ambush ranks would probably yield a 76% accuracy instead of the 75% accuracy I reported previously.
	One more thing... And this is based on anecdotal observations because I didn't think to track it until I was almost done. Particularly in my second and third tests I noticed that a significant number of misses were occurring on certain subsequent swings against the same target. Specifically, I noticed that the chance of successfully hitting the head was extremely low (perhaps even zero) if a previous attack had inflicted a non-fatal rank three head critical. There was no messaging that the head was missing; it's just that follow up attacks would not hit the head. For my part, if I could confirm that the rank three head critical was fouling subsequent aimed shots, I would change my aiming location in that situations.

			Based on today's test I feel extremely confident that 24 ranks of Ambush is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from Ambush training. In my opinion, this finding also strongly suggests that 24 ranks of CM is sufficient to reach the soft cap on aiming accuracy derived from CM training. I stand by my position that aiming accuracy is the sum of two separate equations, one for each skill where each skill has its own independent soft cap.


			==This Space Reserved for Stabbing Things in the Eye==

			Going to need a new script for this and I'll need to run enough tests to see what body location an aimed shot at a missing eye defaults to. But I'm keen to stab things in the eye with my lance, so maybe this weekend.

	==Resources==		==Resources==

MICHN18: /* Speculation and Additional Research */

2015-08-07T10:17:54Z

Speculation and Additional Research

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:17, 7 August 2015
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	Maybe if I'm feeling saucy I'll throw on some hauberk and head back out.		Maybe if I'm feeling saucy I'll throw on some hauberk and head back out.

			One more thing... And this is based on anecdotal observations because I didn't think to track it until I was almost done. Particularly in my second and third tests I noticed that a significant number of misses were occurring on certain subsequent swings against the same target. Specifically, I noticed that the chance of successfully hitting the head was extremely low (perhaps even zero) if a previous attack had inflicted a non-fatal rank three head critical. There was no messaging that the head was missing; it's just that follow up attacks would not hit the head. For my part, if I could confirm that the rank three head critical was fouling subsequent aimed shots, I would change my aiming location in that situations.

	==Resources==		==Resources==

MICHN18 at 09:57, 7 August 2015

2015-08-07T09:57:12Z

@@ Line 39: / Line 39: @@
 Also interestingly, with a maul, I had nearly or above 10% higher accuracy per category. (Without being bonded to it).
 ==Resources==
 * Madmountan's brain and personal calculations.
 [[category:Guides]]