Talk:Charge Item (517)

Greening and Various Results of Major Failure with Spell 517

I fixed some of the wording about "greening" today, at least making sure that the article lines up with what GS4-VIDUUS said concerning updates to greening on September 12, 2018. Mainly what I fixed was: mentioning that the severity of penalties was reduced, and that the penalties no longer include the item being permanently marked as unsellable nor the charges being drained from the item. But there is still some conflicting and/or incomplete information in the article concerning "greening." I can not fix this discrepancy because I do not know the answer for it. Here are the details of what (imo) needs fixing and why:

In the article introduction, it states:

- "Failures with the spell vary. The most extreme failure is complete destruction of the item,"

And in the article introduction, it also states:

- "Other failures include loss of mana points or injury to the caster."

In the Item Charging section, it states:

- "Major failures can also occur. This causes the wizard to lose all of their mana and the item will become unrechargable"

Then in the Item Charging section, same paragraph, it states:

- "This is commonly referred to as "greening" an item:"

In GS4-VIDUUS's message about updates to greening on September 12, 2018 where the penalties were reduced, it states:

- "517 updates -Catastrophic item failure has been removed from this spell. This type of failure will now be covered under the blanket “greening” failure. -The severity of penalties for ”Greening” an item have been reduced. This failure will no longer mark the item as unsellable and drain all charges. Charges will remain at whatever they were before the failure and the item will simply convert to non-rechargeable."

So the three issues I hope can be resolved or answered:

ITEM DESTRUCTION: IS IT STILL POSSIBLE FOR AN ITEM TO BE DESTROYED DURING 517 CHARGING AN ITEM NOW?

-Article Introduction states destruction of the item is possible.
-GS4-VIDUUS's message does not specifically say item destruction is impossible but it seemed to imply it, however, I am unsure. Have any of you charging wizards out there noticed an item being destroyed since Viduus noted the lessening of greening penalties?

LOSS OF ALL THE CASTER'S MANA POINTS -- IS THIS PART OF GREENING?:

-Item Charging section says so
-GS4-VIDUUS's message does not specifically say, and I would like to hear from wizards who charge items a lot, as to whether it is true that when an item is greened the caster loses all their mana.
-And, is the loss of mana part of the "greening" itself or is it just part of the process of failure. I would like the article to make it very clear "what is greening" and distinguish that from "what is NOT a part of greening." Thanks for all of your help with these questions.

SEARCHWORD "GREENING" NEEDS TO BE ADDED:

-I do NOT want to see the searchword "green" lead to this article, though I had at first thought it was a good idea. But for the following reason, it is a bad idea: People searching for "green" should still be able to call up the long list of many pages whose titles or contents include the word "green." Whereas, if both "greening" and "green" were made into searchwords leading to spell 517, a lot of people would miss out on finding "green stuff" if they only know part of the name of that stuff.
-I DO want to see the searchword "greening" lead to this article about spell 517 -- I'm going to check into making this happen, but in the meantime, if someone knows how to do it, please feel free to make it happen, it is the only page that makes sense for the word "greening," and when a person searches for "greening" the first 20 results do NOT include the spell 517 page.

HARTSONG (talk) 10:20, 17 May 2019 (CDT)

Greening will now redirect to the (new) major failure section of the article; this should cause the article to come up automatically if someone puts the term in the search box. I sent out an /ask on Discord to try to clarify the details of catastrophic failure. SMALLMARGIN (talk) 09:45, 19 May 2019 (CDT)

I should add - no promises about what happens if you ignore the "greening" article and instead search for "greening". SMALLMARGIN (talk) 09:49, 19 May 2019 (CDT)

SMALLMARGIN, thank you so much for what you did, the keyword is working very well, and I really like the way you reorganized/reworded the information concerning greening. I appreciate that you left the note about the date the specific changes were announced, at least for now, until people who "knew" the old information have a chance to understand the changes. Thanks a LOT. HARTSONG (talk) 20:15, 28 May 2019 (CDT)

The sentence construction in 'catastrophic failure' reads "This used to cause the wizard to lose all of their items entirely and if it is a container, everything in it as well"... which implies that the wizard would lose their entire inventory? Should this correctly say "all of their mana"? Or "to lose the item (and if it is a container...)"? KRAKII (talk) 12:05, 29 May 2019 (CDT)

One of the most useful things to come with the recent change to this spell is the ability to 'channel' it at a trinket and just add charges, straight up. (Which permanently 'greens' the item; it's a one-time thing.) I do not see this mentioned anywhere in the article; only the ritual version is covered. Should this be described? KRAKII (talk) 12:05, 29 May 2019 (CDT)