Template talk:What Stats Do Table
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I should point out that the statistics table in the New Players' Guide was adapted for the Statistic page and some information was missing from the latter. The original table had a grading system for new players which I did not think was necessary to include on the actual statistics page. However, the grading system is still possibly useful for new players so this version of the table with the grading system should probably exist there (e.g. there should be at least two different, although similar tables instead of just the one linked in both places). -cheers, SARAH3 (talk) 05:00, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- For the average character of what profession? You have a sorcerer semi-tanking INT like the grading indicates and you have a sorcerer in trouble when it comes to Ensorcell, illusions, magic item use and scroll use, and it is not even a primary stat for the profession. I'm not saying you weren't correct for reverting, but the grades are questionable. VANKRASN39 (talk) 08:04, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- I think it's true that the grades are somewhat subjective, but I also think that the solution to revising them isn't to delete them outright (especially accidentally, as appears to be the case here since you left the description for the grade column in the text). I also think that it's worthwhile to discuss the merits of the grades, but perhaps this discussion would be better on the New Players' Guide talk page than here since people are more likely to look there and the grades don't exist on this template. If the general consensus is to eliminate them entirely, then it's definitely fair to replace the table again (or undo the reversion if nobody does anything else on the page in between), but maybe the general consensus will turn out to be that the grades are useful for beginners and just need to be changed up. -cheers, SARAH3 (talk) 09:11, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- After further thinking this morning, grades should really be on the individual profession pages, not given in such a generalized manner. Maybe they shouldn't even be given in grades at all, maybe actual numbers instead (or a range). The discussion is here, let's just keep it going. VANKRASN39 (talk) 09:40, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- Possibly, but I haven't seen any of the beginner professional pages use this table at all, although I haven't double checked all of them recently. I feel like since the table on the main new players' guide it's meant to be generalized, so the grades are meant to be an overview of how useful these stats are to skills and abilities that everyone can access, rather than how useful they are to individual professions and their particular skills. Also, personally, I feel like grades are a range of numbers in a way. -cheers, SARAH3 (talk) 10:43, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- So you propose that people see D in a grade and put between 60-70 in the number? I disagree with this line of thinking as it doesn't account for stat growth factors, or whether one sets stats for max at cap or an easier advancement. The grades are too generalized and are misleading rather than helpful. I think the original table is better (let people see what are the main stats for each profession in the chart as well as the systems each stat affects), along with a brief discussion on setting stats for max at cap or a somewhat easier advancement, and links to the stat cruncher, as well as perhaps more specific guidance in the individual guides (i.e. don't tank your INT if you're a sorcerer, it affects this and that and the other). VANKRASN39 (talk) 10:57, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- Possibly, but I haven't seen any of the beginner professional pages use this table at all, although I haven't double checked all of them recently. I feel like since the table on the main new players' guide it's meant to be generalized, so the grades are meant to be an overview of how useful these stats are to skills and abilities that everyone can access, rather than how useful they are to individual professions and their particular skills. Also, personally, I feel like grades are a range of numbers in a way. -cheers, SARAH3 (talk) 10:43, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- After further thinking this morning, grades should really be on the individual profession pages, not given in such a generalized manner. Maybe they shouldn't even be given in grades at all, maybe actual numbers instead (or a range). The discussion is here, let's just keep it going. VANKRASN39 (talk) 09:40, 20 February 2015 (CST)
- I think it's true that the grades are somewhat subjective, but I also think that the solution to revising them isn't to delete them outright (especially accidentally, as appears to be the case here since you left the description for the grade column in the text). I also think that it's worthwhile to discuss the merits of the grades, but perhaps this discussion would be better on the New Players' Guide talk page than here since people are more likely to look there and the grades don't exist on this template. If the general consensus is to eliminate them entirely, then it's definitely fair to replace the table again (or undo the reversion if nobody does anything else on the page in between), but maybe the general consensus will turn out to be that the grades are useful for beginners and just need to be changed up. -cheers, SARAH3 (talk) 09:11, 20 February 2015 (CST)